Talk:Hudson's Bay Company

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Article issues

This article is a delisted Good Article. I didn't look at the history but the "Shortening the lead section" above concerns a bloated lead that is still "bloated". With 14 projects of interest it seems strange this has been allowed. The "External links" section is extremely bloated as well and the "See also" section appears to suffer from this and in need of trimming. Tags will likely result in a further demotion so if someone can look into this it would be appreciated. Otr500 (talk) 06:47, 17 May 2021 (UTC)

"Projects" don't work. Once the banner has been put on the talk page, that's the last interest most "projects" ever show in an article, in my limited experience of 0.1% of Wikipedia articles. --Wtshymanski (talk) 02:38, 19 May 2021 (UTC)

Changes to lead and 21st century section

Hello. I am Alexandra, and I am requesting the following edits to move some content from the Introduction into the 21st century section, as well as add new content with sources, also to the 21st century section.

1. Please move the following two sentences from the Introduction and place them as a second paragraph in the 21st century section. The sentences are more appropriate as part of the body of the article and not the type of information found in the Introduction:
   • "It had been a member of the International Association of Department Stores from 2001 to 2005."
   • "The company's namesake business division is Hudson's Bay, commonly referred to as The Bay (La Baie in French)."
2. Please move the following sentence, with a minor edit, from the Intro to the beginning of the second paragraph (the paragraph that begins with "On 26 January 2006, the HBC's board...") in the 21st century section. It is also better placed in the body of the article than in the Introduction. It is clear from the context that the company is no longer Canadian owned so we can also remove the second half of that sentence: "In 2006, an American businessman, Jerry Zucker, bought HBC for US$1.1 billion."
3. In the third paragraph of the 21st century section, after the words "On 16 July 2008, the company was sold" please add the phrase "for slightly higher than US$1.1 billion "
4. Add the following to the end of the fourth paragraph in the 21st century section: "In March 2020, Baker and a group of shareholders were successful in taking the company private. "

References

Thank you very much for all your help, Alexandra for HBC (talk) 17:43, 13 October 2021 (UTC)

Hi Alexandra for HBC, I will take a look at these and get back to you about what is possible.MaskedSinger (talk) 10:57, 24 December 2021 (UTC)

Hi MaskedSinger. Thanks, that would be great. Alexandra for HBC (talk) 21:00, 3 January 2022 (UTC)

 Partly done: Hi. Went out on a limb and implemented some of this, hope it's OK, MaskedSinger. I find The second sentence ("La Baie", etc) us relevant for the lede. Furthermore, I tweaked your second request, as the share price was unreferenced anyway, but I believe my edits should satisfy the theme of the request. PK650 (talk) 07:38, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

PK650 Thanks for doing this! It's more than ok. Life took over (ie COVID) and I didn't get around to this. Please feel free to take this over while I admire your handiwork. It's a privilege to meet you and I hope we cross paths again :) MaskedSinger (talk) 16:24, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

MaskedSinger, you're too kind! Hope to see you around PK650 (talk) 06:59, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

Hi PK650. Thanks so much for implementing my edit request. I also have an outstanding edit request on Talk:Richard A. Baker (businessman), who is the CEO of Hudson's Bay. Any help you can render over there would be much appreciated. Thanks again. Alexandra for HBC (talk) 13:54, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

Edits to the Intro section

Hi. This is Alexandra and I have a few more edits I would like to have made to the Introduction. I am calling on PK650 who has been helpful on this page in the past.

1. In the first paragraph, please change "for much of its existence" to "in its early years." This is more specific and less subjective.
2. In the sixth paragraph, which begins "In 2008" please change the third sentence from "HBC's head office is currently located in Brampton, Ontario," to " HBC's headquarters are located in Toronto, New York and Brampton, Ontario."
3. Please add the following phrase to the end of the next (last) sentence in the Intro: " until Baker and a group of shareholders took the company private. "
4. Please add the following two paragraphs to the end of the Intro section:

HBC is now the majority owner of ecommerce companies Saks and Saks Off 5th, both established as separate operating companies in 2021. HBC also wholly owns SFA, the entity that operates Saks Fifth Avenue's physical locations; O5, the operating company for Saks Off 5th stores; The Bay, an ecommerce marketplace and Hudson’s Bay, the operating company for Hudson’s Bay’s brick-and-mortar stores.

HBC also owns or controls, either entirely or with joint venture partners, approximately 40 million square feet of gross leasable real estate through its real estate and investment arm, HBC Properties and Investments, established in October 2020.

References

Thanks so much for your help. Alexandra for HBC (talk) 15:39, 7 March 2022 (UTC)

To push back, on 1) neither term is less subjective. The company was founded in 1670 what does early years mean? It was primarily a fur trading business from that point until well into the 20th century—nearly 400 years, and has not been primarily a fur trading company for less than one quarter of that time. Walter Görlitz (talk) 16:12, 7 March 2022 (UTC)

 Partly done: Thank you for your patience. I agree with Walter Görlitz re the first point. I'll need an independent source for #2; the rest was implemented with minor modifications. PK650 (talk) 03:57, 17 March 2022 (UTC)

Hi PK650. Thanks for your help with the above edits. I would like to suggest new wording for the sentence about the locations of the headquarters. I have supplied independent sources as you asked. I would like to point out that HBC no longer has an office in Brampton, and the new wording for the sentence reflects this. This source shows that the company moved its headquarters from Brampton to Toronto in 2020. The new sentence should say: "HBC's Canadian headquarters are located in Toronto and its U.S. headquarters are in New York."

I also have the following edits I would appreciate if you could implement:

• In the lead, in the paragraph that begins "In 2008, HBC was acquired by NRDC..."Please add the following directly after "Lord & Taylor." "At that time, Richard A. Baker became its executive chairman and governor. He took over as CEO in March 2020."
• Please add the following to the end of the first part of the 21st century section, right after the sentence "In March 2020, Baker and a group of shareholders were successful in taking the company private." Please begin a new paragraph: "Aside from Saks Fifth Avenue and Saks Off Fifth, HBC sold most of its other American operations by mid-2019, and sold Lord & Taylor in August 2019 to Le Tote for $75 million. They sold some of its European operations by August 2019 and its remaining stores, in the Netherlands, were closed by the end of 2019."

References

Thanks so much for all your help. Alexandra for HBC (talk) 14:15, 22 March 2022 (UTC)

I took care of it. Thank you for providing the requested sourcing. PK650 (talk) 07:57, 1 April 2022 (UTC)

Hi PK650. Thanks again for all your help with the above edits. Thanks too for offering to look at my edit request for Richard A Baker as well, whenever you have time. Alexandra for HBC (talk) 14:00, 4 April 2022 (UTC)

Michigan

I feel that the fact that Michigan's flag has an elk and moose from the Hudson Bay Company's coat of arms should be included somewhere, but the location it should be is a mystery to me. 173.64.103.212 (talk) 20:59, 22 September 2022 (UTC)

This is highly dubious for a couple reasons. (1) No part of Michigan was ever part of the HBC's territory. (2) The HBC coat of arms has neither an elk nor a moose. It has four beavers, a squirrel and "two bucks", i.e. male deer. Indefatigable (talk) 23:59, 22 September 2022 (UTC)

Weak section: 1820-1840 period West of the Rockies

1 - Currently describes only nowadays US locations: Fort George (Astoria), Fort Vancouver, Fort Boise, Fort Hall, Yerba Buena trading post, Hawaii store and Northern California Siskiyou Trail 2 - Misses on other important nowadays US locations: Fort Nez Perce, Fort Colville, Fort Umpqua, Fort Nisqually, Cowlitz Prairie (farm) and other PSAC locations 3 - Entirely missed nowadays Canada/southern BC (Fort Langley and Fort Yale), northern coast up to Alaska, fur rich New Caledonia and central BC (Fort Alexandria hub). Also missed on cross-border brigades to York Factory, on the important Russia-America Company (RAC) agreement, on the SS Beaver first steamship to roam through the Pacific Northwest coastline and on the Red River colony Sinclair expedition to settle southern Washington. LeCanardQuoi (talk) 17:57, 25 September 2023 (UTC)

LeCanardQuoi (talk) Completed today a major revision of the 19th century section covering the Pacific Northwest as per planned change notice. Mackie is the main reference for the revision along with countless existing Wikipedia articles expanding on the HBC presence.