Talk:Fives

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Gaelic Handball[edit]

Gaelic handball is a similar sport, geographically closer to UK than pelota etc. It was codified by the GAA in the late 19th Century but the game pre-dates this by some time. I guess similar games were probably played throughout Britain and Ireland, but the game died out except where the rules were coded, namely the English public schools (where each variation became a source of school pride) and Ireland (where the GAA was part of the Gaelic revival - a major voluntary cultural project to preserve and/or create an Irish cultural identity). Which is funny given the class/cultural differences between the two.

Fives Bats[edit]

The Charles Hamilton school stories from The Magnet and The Gem often make reference to people being hit with "fives bats". I presmume, then, that this is a euphemism for punching? 86.158.26.92 (talk) 21:20, 2 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

--

In common with many school boys I was taught fives with bare hands not with gloves: it teachs you to time things better

BozMo

Fives is also popular in some New Zealand schools, notably Otago Boys' High School, where I attended school. There were three proper fives courts (three sided, similar to the Eton rules, but without a step) and a number of other variations, including roofed courts and ones with gaps in the side walls. At any given lunchtime, probably fifty of the 1000 students would play Fives, although there was no organised competition. Also, no gloves were used and the ball was small (about squash ball size) and quite solid. Hughbacca 09:25, 10 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Hey @Hughbacca, thanks for the heads up, I'll include some info on modern Fives in New Zealand.
Frzzl (talk) 11:42, 31 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The starting paragraph seems to suggest that fives is variation of handball, as far as I know (and I am happy to be corrected) Eton fives (I am less knowledgeable about the others) was started by boys trying to find a way to amuse themselves and is unlikely to have been influenced by American handball. Possibly someone who knows more about the history of fives could clarify this point.

Also the balls used in Eton and Rugby fives are very different (with Winchester fives balls being the same as Rugby fives balls), neither being particularly like a golf ball in any respect bar size. Eton balls appear to be made of a mixture of cork and rubber, which is then covered in a white or yellow paint to make them more obvious when travelling at high speed. This means they are quite light, soft to hit and slightly bouncier (all when compared to Rugby fives balls). Rugby fives balls come into two kinds, both are heavier than Eton balls and have differences between themselves. The differences in balls mean differences in the styles of play, in Eton fives control over placement is key, whereas Rugby the speed of the ball has a greater importance over precision.

two main types?[edit]

the article currently says:

"There are two main forms of the game, Eton Fives and Rugby Fives. Eton Fives is played competitively as a doubles game, while Rugby Fives is played as both a singles and a doubles game. The rules for Eton and Rugby Fives were both published in 1931, and Rugby Fives had an official varsity match from 1925. The ball in rugby and Winchester Fives are fairly hard and so the gloves are thicker. In Eton Fives the ball is softer and lighter, and the gloves are fairly thin."

I thought there were three main types - Rugby, Eton and Winchester - but I only ever played rugby fives and I was never clear on the differences. Is Winchester not a meaningful variation? Whether it is or isn't, the above para is the only reference to it in the article and is not helpful as it stands. Harry R 19:39, 18 March 2006 (UTC)[reply] 

== okay and what are the actual RULES? ==

!!! -- Alfakim --  talk  02:11, 22 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, please! What are the rules? -dav4is (talk) 23:02, 3 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

+1 11 years later, and sill no explanation on what the game actually involves. Spike 'em (talk) 15:52, 30 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

A book that might help Brookie :) { - like the mist - there one moment and then gone!} (Whisper...) 16:39, 30 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

General description needed.[edit]

Could a general description of game play be added to this article? I can't figure out what the actual game is. It is a handball game played in a three?-sided court with one or two players? Are there points? How do you tell which team wins? Is the point to bounce it off one of the walls or hit other players or what?

The reference to Real Tennis should be linked.
I was taught Rugby fives at Alleyn's in the late sixties by the Maths teacher, Eric Marsh, who held the world title for a considerable number of years - someone had better check my memory of 9 years. There are a set of rules here, which differ from those in use in the 1960s in the service - there was no preliminary throw, as that allows the server to impart a spin, but was served directly to the side wall in the direction of the wall in front. Bounces off walls don't count as bounces in these rules, in passing - I even knew players who would send the ball off both walls on the way back.
The skill of the game is to some extent in determining whether to volley, receive on the first bounce, or take it off the back wall - dropping it dead off the back wall is nigh on unplayable.
Coincidentally while I was writing the above, a history of fives at alleyns was waiting unread in my in-box, the link hasd been posted as it includes a number of photographs and a disproportionate amount of detail, but it at least provides a mass of extra detail whioch may be useful here in the future. Other schools are of course welcome to add their own links! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.201.73.25 (talk) 09:32, 7 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

some more modalities[edit]

http://ca.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joc_de_pilota

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Oxford-Cambridge Varsity Match[edit]

Two dates of 1928 and 1925 are stated in the article. This would be fine had there been a clear break between the years however the 1925 statement contains the phrase “annually since”. 129.67.16.1 (talk) 21:31, 21 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Original Research[edit]

The varieties section appears to contain a lot of original research - I cannot find anything relating to Gissop's Fives and several other varieties. Seeing that this article has a history of original research (see Bedford Fives), I'm planning on removing this, considering it violates the policies and all that. If anyone can find some resonable sources for variants other then Eton, Rugby and Winchester, feel free to write up something about them.

Frzzl (talk) 11:44, 31 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

TODO:
Rewrite Eton Fives and Westminster Fives sections DONE
Write Rules section
Equipment section? or just expand on use of balls and gloves DONE
Need to rewrite #players - lots more information on playing abroad available.
Frzzl (talk) 23:18, 31 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]
[1][2][3] Multifarious Ailurophile (talk) 12:41, 11 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Palmal Schwannoma
A 2012 study found a possible link between Fives playing and palmal schwannoma; a rare nerve sheath tumor was located around the area of hitting the Fives ball, which was most likely created as a result of repeated microtrauma and possible dermal implantation of leather fibers from hitting the ball. However, a definitive connection between playing the sport is unproved, as schwannoma case studies are infrequent.[4] Multifarious Ailurophile (talk) 15:27, 13 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
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