Talk:Sheridan Le Fanu

Untitled

Both Green Tea and Carmilla are shortish stories, and almost certainly in the public domain; would it be useful to put them up as an illustration to this article (which I intend to flesh out)? sjc

I have added a link to an etext of Carmilla in the main article. --- hajhouse

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find his prose too wordy and his characters frustratingly daft.

POV? I haven't heard many who complain about the quality of his prose and characterization. Mandel 07:08, Dec 9, 2004 (UTC)

No less NPOV than a lot of necessary concessions to literary critical practices in a wiki context, one might argue. But I suppose I have to grant that describing early Victorian prose narrative style as wordy or belaboured from a contemporary point of view is a bit like describing first world war era film as 'a bit grainy'. Le Fanu strikes me as far from the worst offender in this department, given his era, so as far as I'm concerned, this could stand to be omitted simply because insofar as it is true, it goes without saying in historical context, and I think this is within that minimum of attention to historical context one can assume of the general wiki audience. I'll change this to something which at least acknowledges historical context iminently, barring objections or useful citations --Yst 22:59, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

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Is "Sheridan" the forename and "Le Fanu" the family name? How about the grandmother "Alice Sheridan Le Fanu", then? Isn't in fact "Sheridan Le Fanu" the family name, and Joseph the forename? Who knows for sure? The Library of Congress catalog has 75 entries for "Le Fanu, Joseph Sheridan". while "Le Fanu, Sheridan" is a redirect to the full name. --LA2 08:41, 2005 Jan 31 (UTC)

Rewrite

I've done a fairly extensive re-write of this article. However I still think it can be improved (and expanded) a lot more. What do you think? Colin4C 03:05, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

I think it reads a lot better now, but I agree it could be expanded further. Natalieduerinckx 10:48, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

I'm working on it Natalie...(and maybe you too?). I must confess my amazement that such an important writer as Sheridan Le Fanu arouses so little interest amongst wikipedia editors. And there is still no wikipedia article for Uncle Silas, which still remains defiantly red on the hyperlink...Colin4C 17:15, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

I've been rereading Uncle Silas (hadn't read it for about 2 decades!) so I've started a new page for it. My plot summary gets vague at the end because I'm still only 2/3rds through it, though I remember roughly how it goes. I think the main thing that needs to be done is in the "influence" bit at the end. Also a bibliography of good books & editions would be handy, e.g. the WJ McCormack book. --ND 04:58, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

Great! I've made a start on a page for The Purcell Papers, by the way, which probably could be vastly improved...Would be great if we could do for Le Fanu what other wikipedia editors have done for Poe and Lovecraft, for instance...Colin4C 06:17, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

Well, that will require me to read more of his works! I do have a half-dozen of them around in my wife's collection. Plus the two Dover editions of his short stories (haven't seen The Purcell Papers, just those selections). -- I think the most important thing isn't so much the addition of plot summaries &c as trying to explain what's distinctive/significant about his work, giving critical quotes of utility, &c. --ND 06:44, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

Finished the book--at the moment I'm inclined to leave my plot summary as it stands, since I'm not sure that any more needs to be said about the mechanics of the plot. -- Any reason why you (C4C) deleted your earlier comments on this page? I don't mind, it's just that I didn't see anything wrong with them. Yeah, WJ MacCormack is extremely quirky; I know his writing on/editing of Austin Clarke better, but it's also a little idiosyncratic.... He's also a kind of interesting poet (under the name Hugh Maxton). --ND 22:48, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

Well after I had written my comments, I found that I wasn't addressing your points at all, but had gone off on a tangent of my own. I have some strong hunches about where Le Fanu is coming from, but as I can't back them up by references, perhaps discretion is the best option....Anyway (hint to budding writers) I do think a new biography of Le Fanu is called for, with more emphasis on the unconscious, folklore, the supernatural and questions of sexuality, (plus, of course, large colour pictures of Ingrid Pitt as 'Carmilla'........).Colin4C 11:42, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

More novels

Just added a page for The House by the Churchyard. Corrections/expansions are welcome! I "straightened out" the plot a lot in the effort to make things clear, in the sense that rather than detailing revelations in the order they appear in the book (since this would entail giving things in very skewed sequence) I gave things in roughly chronological order. --ND 10:11, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

Looks good. Maybe a good idea to link to Chapelizod? Colin4C 10:42, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

Reference in lead

Putting a reference in an article's lead is discouraged, since the lead is intended merely as a summary of information that appears elsewhere in the article. If Sage's introduction is the source for any statements in the body of the article, please place the reference at the appropriate point. And it should be in the form "Sage, Victor. Introduction. Uncle Silas by Sheridan Le Fanu. Penguin, 2000" or similar. Deor 00:27, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

Pronunciation of name

Perhaps it should be mentioned that "Le Fanu" is pronounced "Leff-new", though I'm having trouble finding a source. Opera hat (talk) 14:42, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Can anyone find such a source? I was expecting one here. Having heard four different pronunciations (LEFF-uh- new, luh-FAN-oo, luh-FAY-noo, and LEFF-new, any of all of which may be suspect), I'd say it's definitely required, considering that there are WP articles with less mysteriously-pronounced names that have some sort of guide. 12.233.146.130 (talk) 23:41, 11 February 2013 (UTC)

Here's Debrett's saying Leff-new. Opera hat (talk) 19:38, 3 January 2023 (UTC)

I've heard various pronunciations of his name. I use the one my father used. He was born in Dublin in 1906, and was an enthusiastic reader of Le Fanu's stories. I believe these had rather fallen from favour, and were revived thanks to M.R. James, who edited a collection of Le Fanu's short stories under the title of Madam Crowl's Ghost and Other Stories. I have a copy here, and believe it may still be in print. This came out when my father was a young man, so the connection seems not unlikely. Anyway, my father pronounced his surname as Le (as in Le Bourget) and Fan-Yew, with the emphasis on the Fan syllable. I should say that Dublin pronunciations can be idiosyncratic, and not what people often expect. 92.10.26.28 (talk) 16:05, 22 August 2018 (UTC)

Dublin pronunciations are indeed idiosyncratic, as witness Aungier Street (which features in a Le Fanu story), Dorset Street, Westmoreland Street, and nearby D'Olier Street. None of these is pronounced as a non-Dubliner might expect. As for Le Fanu, I also pronounce it as Le and Fan-yew, with the first syllable stressed. Joseph Sheridan (talk) 15:51, 3 May 2022 (UTC)

Bad prose (imho) in present article

My now-reverted revision was an attempt to improve the bad prose (imho) of the article.

He was the premier ghost story writer of the nineteenth century and had a seminal influence on the development of this genre in the Victorian era.

His father was a stern Protestant churchman and imbued his family with a religious sense that bordered on Calvinism.

Although Thomas Le Fanu made efforts to keep up the facade of a comfortably-off family, they were constantly beset by financial problems.

Imho, anyone who can read English like that without feeling a bit (how shall I put it?) queasy hasn't got much grasp of what good prose is like. Which is why I have no hope of improving the article. It's a shame, imho, that a writer as good as SLF should have an article like this on the world's premierly (and seminally) influential information-promulgation portal. Then again, it's not as tho' he lacks company. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Westofthewall (talk • contribs) 10:33, 15 July 2011 (UTC)

Well, after reading through the edits several times, and being pretty familiar with the subject matter, and concentrating on the content rather than the style, I thought they were not an improvement. Though the article has been "improved" several times already I agree that clumsy phrases remain and if you feel strongly enough about your edits feel free to re-insert them. I shan't rv a second time. Hohenloh ⁺ 01:23, 16 July 2011 (UTC)

Thank you for a reasonable response, and I apologize for the sarcastic tone of my original post. However, I do get exasperated by the bad English so common on Wikipedia, unless it's in an appropriate place (e.g. the Jeffrey Archer article). Westofthewall (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 09:10, 22 July 2011 (UTC).

The synopsis of Shalken the Painter is misleading. He didn't return from the grave expressly to claim his bride - he was already active when he spied her. Contrary to this. the article implies the revenant had a relationship with the girl before his death. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.35.168.101 (talk) 22:51, 15 November 2011 (UTC)

The Biography

The Biography should be divided into subsections. As it is, it is much too long and involved.

Preferably, the major headline would include an "executive summary", and then the individual chapters a more deep review. 88.114.128.29 (talk) 22:42, 12 October 2012 (UTC)

I disagree. Encyclopedic writing doesn't necessarily involve dividing everything up into short snippets, nor is doing so always desirable. Deor (talk) 23:10, 12 October 2012 (UTC)

New Uncle Silas adaptation

An adaptation of Uncle Silas was broadacast by the BBC in January 2013. Worth a mention? 82.153.122.226 (talk) 16:55, 9 January 2013 (UTC)

Are you referring to the three-part radio adaptation that's running this week on BBC Radio 4? It was originally broadcast in May 2008, but I don't see any mention of it in our Uncle Silas article—where mention might be appropriate; this article, on the other hand, is about Le Fanu the person. You could change the heading "Film and television adaptations" in that article to "Film, television and radio adaptations" and add a sentence or two about it (perhaps mentioning that it starred, apparently, Teresa Gallagher as Maud and Graham Crowden as Silas). Deor (talk) 17:29, 9 January 2013 (UTC)

Nationality

Mr Le Fanu's nationality was not Irish. He was a British subject. The places where he born and died may now be part of the Irish Republic, that does not retrospectively render him an Irish citizen. That would be like saying that Julius Caesar was an Italian.

The "Irish" in the opening sentence does not imply that he was not a British subject (and it certainly doesn't imply that he was a citizen of the Republic of Ireland). Nationality is not necessarily equivalent to citizenship (P. G. Wodehouse was a U.S. citizen for the last 20 years of his life, yet I think few people would call him an American writer), and many Wikipedia articles about UK people characterize them according to which constituent country of the United Kingdom—England, Scotland, Wales, Ireland, Northern Ireland—they hail(ed) from or are primarily associated with. Le Fanu happened to live during a period when Ireland was part of the United Kingdom, so he might be described either as Irish or as British. (For a discussion of the matter, with some examples, see the essay WP:UKNATIONALS.) Since his writings frequently deal with specifically Irish settings and topics, "Irish" seems to me the better choice here. Deor (talk) 12:55, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

Of course Le Fanu (a distant relative through the Sheridan side) was Irish. He was born in Dublin, which was (and is) the capital of Ireland. He had Anglo-Irish and Huguenot blood, as did many inhabitants of Dublin and Ireland. In the eyes of some people, this might disqualify him from any claim to be properly Irish, but this is a political view. It is generally held that anyone born in a particular country enjoys the benefit of that country's nationality. Any alternative view can only lead to chaos. Similarly, Robert Burns was Scottish. In his day, and indeed today, that involved being a British subject (or citizen, as we now say). Let us suppose that those seeking independence for Scotland succeed in their aim. Would this affect the claim of Burns to be Scottish, because he was a British subject by birth? Joseph Sheridan (talk) 12:47, 3 May 2022 (UTC)

House pictured in "Biography" section

I've just reverted someone's change of the caption from "Childhood home of Sheridan Le Fanu in Chapelizod, Dublin" to "House in Chapelizod that inspired Le Fanu's House by the Churchyard". The image's description page identifies the house as Le Fanu's birthplace, whereas photos of the same dwelling are identified here as "Joseph Sheridan Le Fanu's House, Chapelizod", here as "this gaunt three-storey house that provided the setting for Sheridan Le Fanu's novel The House by the Churchyard", and here as "House on Main Street, Chapelizod once home to Sheridan Le Fanu". Can anyone provide a reliable source stating what, exactly, the relationship between Le Fanu and the house was? Was he born there, did he live there (and when?), or did it just inspire the eponymous house in the novel? Deor (talk) 15:23, 8 November 2014 (UTC)

Le Fanu was born in Lower Dominick Street, Dublin, which is not far from the Rotunda and King's Inns on the north side of the city centre. From the article, it seems his father did not then have an ecclesiastical living, as that at Limerick is described as his second rectorship, the chaplaincy at the Phoenix Park being the first. Was he recently ordained when his son was born, I wonder? It's also possible that the house in Lower Dominick Street was not the family residence, but maybe a small private lying-in clinic, of a type where ladies of a certain social standing sometimes underwent their confinement - rather than at home, as was usual for the majority of the population. It may have been the house of a relative. A glance at the relevant census could clarify this. Chapelizod is up by the Phoenix Park, and would probably have had the character of a distinct village in those days, rather than just part of the city as it is now. Joseph Sheridan (talk) 15:42, 3 May 2022 (UTC)

Cause of death?

I ventured to this article after reading an introduction to a volume of LeFanu's short stories that described his death as "rather sudden" and said nothing else about it. Typically one can count on an encyclopedia article to mention the cause or circumstances of death, but this article also declares only that he died. What of? 2602:30A:C0AE:EB40:CE9:8A14:14E4:F9EB (talk) 08:12, 19 January 2015 (UTC)

The article states „Le Fanu died of a heart attack” just one year after publishing Carmilla. However, I overheard arguments that revealing details about Madame la Comptesse was not without consequences. Reading between the lines, his death notice could be read as if his heart did not stop beating because of an obstruction in one of the coronary arteries (as it is common in fatal events of cardiovascular disease), but that his heart stopped because there was simply nothing left in his arteries and venae to beat on. In the night of his death he was mysteriously drained clean of even the last drop of blood. 42.117.196.40 (talk) 04:13, 26 April 2021 (UTC)

References

Should there be a section for "citations in other works"?

I don't know the extent of the references to be found in other works, but do I know of at least one: in Dorothy Sayer's "Gaudy Night," there are several references to her protagonist Harriet's intentions to work on a biography of Le Fanu, and in her later book, "Thrones, Dominions, Powers" a notice that Harriet (now Wimsey) had finished it, and that it had been published.

I took this as an indication that Sayers herself was intersted in Le Fanu (by extension, no other reference) and almost expected to see that she had in fact herself done such a study...she seems to have wanted to highlight it, and "GN" definitely has a few eerie moments in the plot and description, as well as some hysterical female characters like Le Fanu's.

Perhaps there are others?173.14.170.177 (talk) 18:06, 24 November 2015 (UTC)173.14.170.177 (talk) 18:03, 24 November 2015 (UTC)

Assessment comment

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Sheridan Le Fanu/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

Classed as B but demoted importance from High to Mid, though it should even possibly be Low as he is not well known ww2censor 04:05, 26 August 2007 (UTC)

Last edited at 04:05, 26 August 2007 (UTC). Substituted at 05:58, 30 April 2016 (UTC)