Talk:Moishe Rosen

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Untitled[edit]

Please could someone who knows explain why Martin Rosen currently redirects here? There's no mention in the Moishe Rosen article to the name Martin. The reason I ask is that I would like to write an article about another Martin Rosen, the director of the Watership Down film, so will need to change the redirect when that's done. Loganberry 03:25, 22 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Ah.. apparently Martin Rosen was Moishe's birth name. (In which case, should that be mentioned in this article?) Thank you to David Cannon for the information. Loganberry 13:56, 22 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Further to this... I've moved the director to Martin Rosen (director), sorted out the "What links here" for the plain "Martin Rosen" page and set up a disambig on it. Loganberry 13:56, 23 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Orthodox?[edit]

Rosen was raised in an Orthodox family? I know this is often claimed by Messianic Jews, but is rarely the case. Perhaps "traditional" would be more accurate? Jayjg (talk) 19:03, 23 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

i know this is old but he was not. His father wasn't Orthodox, they were reformed. His own mother was never converted. He wasn't even a Jew. 2600:1700:BFC0:C320:8FCE:3324:5DB1:C739 (talk) 02:52, 18 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Bold text

Moishe was raised in an orthodox family but he originally wasn't really a believer in God.

His family was not Orthodox[edit]

Here is the quote from Religious Leaders of America. His family was not Orthodox at all.

"Martin Meyer Rosen, better known under his public name, Moishe Rosen, the founder of Jews for Jesus, is the son of Rose Baker and Ben Rosen. He was raised in a nominal Reform Jewish home in Denver, Colorado, where his family had moved when he was two years old. As he grew older, he observed Jewish traditions, but had come to doubt any religious truths. In 1947 he enrolled at Colorado University, but dropped out in 1951 before completing his degree. During his college days, in 1950, he married Ceil Starr. A chance meeting with Orville Freeman, an Evangelical Christian, prompted a spiritual search for both Rosen and his wife. Both converted to Christianity in 1953."

that quote was in error, the Rosen family attended an orthodox synogogue, and refered to themselves as orthodox, (so they were not nominlly reform), although in practice they were not shomer shabos, nor very religious in belief. I modiffied the artlch to say"nominally religious Jewish family ,that attended a local Orthodox synogogue", as it better reflects the facts than "nominally reform". I also changed "Converted to Christianity" to "became a Christian" because Moishe does think of himself as a Convert, and Changed "President" to "Executive Director", which was his official title. -Nistar 04:05, 21 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]
How do you know his family attended an Orthodox synagogue? Jayjg (talk) 16:59, 21 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]
see http://www.jewsforjesus.org/about/headquarters/moishe Nistar 09:42, 21 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]
It's a dubious source, and trivia in any event. Jayjg (talk) 22:33, 16 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]
First of all the source is as autoritive on the ;life of Moise rosen as any other source in the artlicle. Second this point is no more trivial than the following points which ytou left in. Please use the same standard to qualify the information you agree with as the inbformation you appose. otyherwise you are in violation of the wikipedia NPOV policy. Nistar 05:44, 20 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I removed the rest of the trivia12.218.144.90 17:34, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
And I've reinserted it: it was sourced. David Cannon 22:17, 4 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
if your going to reinsert it. reinsert all of it. the fact that he attended an orthodox synogogue is as relevent as the fact that his maternal grandparents were reformed jews. Nistar 01:21, 8 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
And I've reverted your vandalism. Jayjg (talk) 06:02, 14 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Jayjg you can't have it both ways. either all of the information in the past set of edits is trivia or its not, how can deleting all of it or including all of it constitute valdalism but including part of it be reverisng vandalism? i hterefore have put nback the rest of the sourced information that you have deleted. Moshe's orthodox synogogue attendence cannot be considered more trivial that any of the other info you just restored. I would ask that you stop your practice of trying to inesrt you POV in the guise of inforcing wikipedia policy.

http://www.jewsforjudaism.org/web/bookreviews/sharethenewlife.html points out

That Rosen wrote (Moishe Rosen with William Proctor, Jews for Jesus, Old Tappan, N.J: Fleming H. Revell, 1974)

"My mother's parents, Reform Jews from Austria, immigrated to this country. . . . My father's father . . . was an Orthodox believer. . . ." page 15

"My father was not very religious. . . . Though my father attended synagogue, he often told us, 'Religion is a racket.'" page 17

Rosen sums up his religious training by saying, "My father's belief-'religion is a racket' --made more sense to me as I got older." page 21

Actually, it is Ceil Rosen who Mr. Rosen, in the book Jews for Jesus, states grew up in an Orthodox Jewish home. She is portrayed as bitter and scornfully hostile toward her adoptive parent's Orthodoxy. Mr. Rosen writes, "Ceil herself came from an Orthodox family which kept separate dishes and ate only kosher food. But Ceil herself was a professed atheist who reacted violently against the restrictive customs that her family had imposed on her. I generally tried to observe the main fast days, such as Yom Kippur, the Day of Atonement, but she had nothing but contempt for such practices. I remember we were together one year on Yom Kippur, and though she rarely treated me to anything on our dates, she made a special point of buying me an ice cream cone. . . ." page 21

Note that if she was not born Jewish, then she would have to have accepted conversion when she became adult (at twelve years of age). If she did not accept the conversion, then she would be regarded as not Jewish according to Jewish law.


The Controversy Surrounding Moishe Rosen[edit]

Moishe Rosen not only has created controversy with his contention that Jews need to believe in Jesus, but also his heavyhanded leadership style within the Jews for Jesus organization. For details of this, see [1] and [2]

Please do not revert this article[edit]

You are censoring his temper problem! Where do you have the right to do such censorship.

Okay would whoever that is reverting the changes please stop. 203.214.133.79 16:51, 29 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Is there a problem? Homestarmy 01:14, 19 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
No, there is no problem. Last month, I raised an issue because I was unsure whether the editor was in fact the subject of the article that he claimed to be. As it turned out, he was genuine, so there is no problem. David Cannon 03:35, 19 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

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