Talk:Hurricane Elena

Surge

I couldn't confirm the storm surge height, or the sentence "did not become extratropical until passing over Nova Scotia, Canada". Can anyone help with these? -- sannse (talk) 21:08, 11 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Todo

More impact. Jdorje 23:01, 11 January 2006 (UTC)

Better? Hurricanehink 22:37, 22 January 2006 (UTC)

B class

I've tagged this article as a B Class for WP Alabama. I believe if the article were properly sourced, it could easily pass GA. - auburnpilot talk 03:51, 21 April 2007 (UTC)

The biggest thing holding this article back is a lack of a preparations section, mentioning the series of raising/lowering of gale and hurricane watches/warnings around that Labor Day weekend. Thegreatdr (talk) 22:49, 16 July 2009 (UTC)

Elena a category 4?

Someone edited the infobox, stating that Elena is a: 140 mph category 4 hurricane.

I'm not sure if it was a category 4, when the intro states it as a 3 —Preceding unsigned comment added by TheAustinMan (talk • contribs) 02:27, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

Sources for rewrite

Sources for me to use...

Meteorological

• [1]
• [2]
• [3]

Preparations

• [4]
• [5]

Impact/Aftermath

• [6]
• [7]
• [8]
• [9]
• [10]
• [11]
• [12]

General

• [13]

Juliancolton (talk) 19:06, 28 July 2011 (UTC)

Todo

• Impact pictures
• [14] to finalize some bits of damage info
• By-county search
• St. George Causeway stuff
• Better external links
• NCDC

Juliancolton (talk) 20:21, 14 April 2013 (UTC)

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Hurricane Elena/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Hurricanehink (talk · contribs) 18:10, 17 April 2013 (UTC)

I guess I'll be reviewing this beast. As a general rule of thumbs, the sentences could probably be tightened, which would be my primary suggestion before an inevitable FAC.

Lede

• "wrought havoc to property and environment" - should that be "the environment"? I don't often see "wrought havoc to environment"
• "Elena developed on August 28 near Cuba, and after traveling lengthwise across the island with no known effects" - you never mention anything about Cuba impact or not. Have you tried a Spanish search? --♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 18:10, 17 April 2013 (UTC)
  • This is still bordering original research, as the article mentions nothing about any Cuban effects. You can't say "no major effects" without backing it up. --♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 00:05, 18 April 2013 (UTC)

Meteorological history

• "The origins of Hurricane Elena can be traced to an easterly tropical wave which was first identified off the western coast of Africa on August 23" - I think it should be "that" instead, since it's a non-restricted clause.
• "In response, the National Hurricane Center upgraded the depression to Tropical Storm Elena midday on August 28, while it was still situated over northern Cuba" - careful with pronoun agreement. Since the subject of the first clause is the NHC, that's the antecedent for the subsequent "it". It would say "...to Tropical Storm Elena over northern Cuba midday on August 28." That also helps cut down on the wording a bit.
• "striking the New Orleans, Louisiana, and Biloxi, Mississippi, area within 30 hours" - given how late "area" is in the sentence (which makes "the New Orleans" seem weird), why not say "striking between New Orleans, Louisiana and Biloxi, Mississippi within 30 hours"?
• "Roughly 24 hours later after attaining hurricane intensity" - remove later. In fact...
  • "Unexpectedly, a mid-to-upper-level trough of low pressure diving in from the northwest created a weakness in the easterly currents, allowing Elena to recurve and slow drastically in forward speed.[1][4] Roughly 24 hours later after attaining hurricane intensity, the storm abruptly turned toward the east in response to the trough." - this could probably be merged into one sentence. I would recommend something like "Unexpectedly, a mid- to upper-level trough diving in from the northwest created a weakness, causing Elena to slow drastically and turn abruptly eastward roughly 24 hours after attaining hurricane intensity." Just throwing it out there, but it's a place where you could tighten the wording.
    • I tried a couple different ways to merge the two sentences and couldn't come up with something I liked. I don't want to remove "in the easterly currents", and the recurve and eastward turn are sequential events (in my judgement) rather than two ways to describe the same thing. Juliancolton (talk) 22:48, 17 April 2013 (UTC)
• "After the passage of the upper-level system early on August 31, however" - however is unneeded.
  • Eh, it contradicts the previous sentence, which discusses forecasts. I think the "however" serves to help make the section a flowing narrative rather than a mere chronology. Juliancolton (talk) 22:48, 17 April 2013 (UTC)
• "with maximum sustained winds were estimated at 105 mph (170 km/h)" - remove "were"
• "sliding south of Florida's Forgotten and Emerald coasts" - it's interesting mentioning these fairly obscure terms, but why not just use "Florida panhandle"? More people know of it.
• "Biloxi, Harrison County, Mississippi" - is the county important?
• Any reason you don't say where it weakened to TD status?

Preparations

• "Collectively, it was the "largest number of people ever evacuated", according to Case (1986)." - why not say according to Robert Case? The year thing is throwing me off.
• "and residents in the New Orleans area were particularly weary of what was being called the first serious hurricane threat in 20 years" - any way to link that to Hurricane Betsy? It's always good mentioning the exact name, but I realize if you can't due to source limitations.
• "that Elena would head further east" - it should be "farther". Any time it refers to distance, it's "farther". Otherwise (such as the country progressed "further" in the field of meteorology), it's "further".
• "stirring more concern for the eastern Gulf Coast." - why more concern? That seems to be the first mention of eastern Gulf in the preps section.
  • Everyone east of the western FL Panhandle thought they were safe until the storm started turning, which made them more concerned (despite the uncertainty). Juliancolton (talk) 22:48, 17 April 2013 (UTC)
• Not sure if I should ask here, but did the mass evacuations caused by Elena have any implications for future storms?

--♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 18:10, 17 April 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for starting the review. I left a couple responses above to comments I wasn't sure I agreed with, but I've tended to almost everything listed so far. Thanks again! Juliancolton (talk) 22:48, 17 April 2013 (UTC)

Impact

• "134 people in Elena's path were hospitalized with injuries and ailments" - great example of how you can shorten it. Try "Elena injured 134 people." Nice and simple.
• "thousands more of mobile homes, apartments, and condominiums were damaged or destroyed." - bit on the awkward side. Why not something like "thousands of... were also damaged or destroyed."
• "When a cargo ship underway close to the hurricane's center rolled in the high seas on August 29" - something is wonky here.
• You should mention somewhere (maybe aftermath) that Kate in November caused further damage to the oyster industry.
• "In Key West, on the east side of Elena's strengthening center, gusty winds exceeded 50 mph (80 km/h), while 1.8 in (46 mm) of rain and higher-than-normal tides were also observed on the island." - get rid of "on the island"
• You might find some useful crop information here.
• " Debris from the Big Indian Rocks Fishing Pier drifted northward toward Clearwater Pass and accumulated along private beaches at Belleair Shore, where it allegedly acted to worsen property damage." - don't use "allegedly". If you don't know if it happened or not, I'd remove it.
• I don't get the fifth paragraph in Florida. It seems like some of that content is redundant with the third paragraph, since you mention erosion happening in two different paragraphs. Also, " marked by a period of 13 seconds on August 31" - just seems unnecessary IMO.
• Given that Elena didn't strike Florida, I think the following info should be moved later in the article.
  • When tropical cyclones move over land, they often produce the wind shear and atmospheric instability required for the development of weak, embedded supercell thunderstorms, which can produce tornadoes. These tornadoes are usually weak and short-lived, but still capable of producing significant damage.
• "leaving 64 single-family houses and mobiles homes destroyed" - was that a typo or was it referring to something else?
• "Dauphin Island received a storm surge of 8.4 ft (2.6 m) which resulted in substantial flooding" - again, which --> that
• "With its location close to the storm's center, and its similarities to a barrier island, Dauphin Island" - isn't Dauphin a barrier island? Its article says it is.
• You should link Frederic in the Alabama section since you mention it there first, not in the Mississippi section.
• "the most significant effects of the storm stemmed from its strong winds gusting to over 120 mph (190 km/h)" - the last part (gusting to...) seems redundant since the next sentence includes actual gusts, of which only one is over 120.
• Any reason you don't use this to indicate that C3 winds were recorded in Alabama, Mississippi, and Florida?
• "powerlines" - one word or two?
• "Schools in seven southern counties were forced to closed due to structural damage." - this seems like an odd way to start a paragraph, since you had mentioned schools a few paragraphs earlier.
• "at the latter, damages included the cost of healing a Florida Sandhill Crane's injured leg" - I wouldn't think of an injured animal as "damage"

I'll get aftermath later. --♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 01:46, 18 April 2013 (UTC)

Aftermath

• "The name was replaced by Erika, which was first used during the 1991 season." - that'd be good to get a source.
• "After the city of Cedar Key dropped its participation in the National Flood Insurance Program, leaving residents unable to purchase flood insurance for their property" - when did this happen?

That's it for the article. Great work all around, and the above is fairly minor. --♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 02:16, 18 April 2013 (UTC)

Peer review

• In the opening sentence, it might be better to use "affected" instead of "impacted", since I know some people object to using "impacted".
• "the U.S. Gulf Coast " - I would spell this out. Not everyone in the world knows what "U.S." means (nor necessarily which gulf).
• "Elena repeatedly defied official forecasts" - did Elena also defy unofficial forecasts? I think you can cut the official part.
• "as a Category 3 major hurricane" - feels kinda redundant saying both here.
• I feel you could mention in the lede when Elena reached peak winds (and what they were). Surprised you didn't.
• "The hurricane's unpredictable shifts in direction" is a weird way to start a paragraph. Maybe - "The largest peacetime evacuation in the United States history occurred due to the hurricane's unpredictable shifts in direction."
• "and hundreds of thousands of residents and tourists along portions of the Gulf Coast were forced to leave their homes" - do tourists have homes from which they evacuate? I mean, potentially vacation homes, but since that's not necessarily a factor, I'd remove "their homes" and rejigger the end of the sentence.
• "Given the highly dynamic situation at hand" - and I'd say "despite"
• "the storm's potential for destruction" --> "the storm's destructive potential" ?
• "off the coast of Florida resulted in severe beach erosion and damage to coastal buildings" - I'd switch the first "coast" to "off western Florida".
• Watch for redundant links. Have you gotten the tool that says "Highlight duplicate links"? That'd be really helpful.
• "and one on a ship in the Gulf of Mexico" - did the person die on a ship? Or did he fall off?
• " Damage totaled about $1.3 billion" - you should have a note here that all damage totals are in 1985 USD (check other hurricane articles for formatting).
• " declared parts of Alabama, Mississippi, and Florida federal disaster areas" - is "as" needed before "federal"?
• "clipped westward across the Atlantic at up to 35 mph (56 km/h)" - is a word missing? When removing the adjectival clause, it says "clipped at up to 35 mph", but clipped isn't the most.... useful? ... of words.
• "while situated over the Greater Antilles, the disturbance developed into a tropical depression" - maybe be more specific where it formed?
• "Passing north of Havana, Cuba, Elena emerged into the Gulf of Mexico" - I'd start this sentence with "After"
• "At 1200 UTC on August 29, Elena intensified into a Category 1 hurricane." - just out of the blue? What conditions were favorable? Also, this would be a good time to mention SSHS, if you didn't before.
• "northwestward track" or "northwest track"? Northwestward seems like an adverb, whereas northwest is an adjective/noun. I think. Don't quote me.
• "Extrapolation from the storm's eastward progress" - from or of?
• "After the passage of the upper-level system early on August 31, however" - cut "however". It's useless!
• "with winds of 125 mph (205 km/h) as estimated by aircraft" - get rid of "as"
• "minimum central air pressure rose about 17 mb while the hurricane moved just 20 mi (32 km)" - that's misleading without any reference to time. Isidore 02 filled like 50 kb while moving about 20 mi, but it remained over land for like two days.
• "The unpredictable nature of the hurricane, combined with its arrival in popular tourist destinations on the Labor Day holiday weekend" - I'd say "in conjunction" works better than "combined".
• "Evacuations and the issuance of weather advisories" - issuance just sounds pompous, IDK. Why not "issuing"?
• "Much of that section of shoreline was under a hurricane warning on two separate occasions for two different trajectories of the storm." - why not be clearer here which parts were under two hurricane warnings? I'm sure Sarasota wasn't under them twice.
• "Some evacuees moved inland to meet relations" - similar two two items above, why not "relatives"?
• "Huge crowds formed at stores as individuals searched for emergency supplies" - "Individuals formed crowds at stores while searching for emergency supplies" - just throwing out an alternative to the writing.
• "called in 250 National Guard troops" - "activated" might be more formal than "called in"
• "In the greater St. Petersberg, Pinellas County, area alone" - try rewording so it doesn't have the two commas like that so soon.
• " A forecaster at the National Hurricane Center figured the worst of the hurricane's effects to have been focused around Dauphin Island, Alabama, and Pascagoula, Mississippi" - "figured" doesn't work here.
• "Power outages plagued the entire storm-affected region, leaving about 550,000 customers without electricity over the duration of the event." - I'd simply and just say "affecting 550,000 customers" after "region,"
• "and a 6 in (150 mm) oil pipeline broke during the hurricane at an estimated cost of $1.6 million (the same pipeline broke a total of three times during the 1985 hurricane season)" - three times including Elena?
• "which "[dealt] the final blow" to oyster beds" - who said this quote?
• "The storm's first effects in Florida were felt late on August 28" - why not simplify and say "The storm began affecting Florida late on August 28"?
• "gusty winds exceeded 50 mph (80 km/h)" - is this a wind gust?
• "Further south in the Tampa area" - any time it refers to distance, it should be "farther"
• "with a local maximum of 10.57 in (268 mm) at Jacksonville" - at or in?
• "At low-lying Cedar Key to the north, storm surge exceeded 9 ft (2.7 m)" - I don't get why this isn't in the storm surge paragraph
• "isolating the city for a time" --> "temporarily isolating the city"
• "Pinellas County suffered some of the worst damage from Hurricane Elena in Florida.[53] Forty-four single-family homes were destroyed, 31 more were damaged, and several condominiums, townhouses, and commercial buildings were damaged or destroyed. " - I feel like these sentences could be merged.
• "2.15 mi (12,500 km/h) " -eh?
• "The hurricane cost roughly $100 million in Pinellas County,[23] and at the height of the storm, over 500,000 of its residents were without electricity." - these don't necessarily make sense next to each other.
• "Along the coastline south of Pinellas County, six residences were destroyed." - this feels kinda dumpy on its own. It'd make sense when you mention the coastal impacts in the county earlier.
• "damage to property" --> "property damage"?
• "Several miles of roadways" - roadways or roadway?
• "St. George Island" - this is what I mean about overlinking. You just linked it like four sentences earlier! >:(
• Maybe link "U.S. Route 98" to U.S. Route 98 in Florida?
• "When tropical cyclones move over land, they often produce the wind shear and atmospheric instability" - do tropical cyclones actually produce that wind shear? Also, why mention this here? Elena didn't make landfall in Florida.
• "leaving 64 single-family houses and mobile homes destroyed" - why not say "destroying 64 single-family houses and mobile homes"?
• "In nearby Marion County, Florida, tornadic activity left six mobile homes destroyed, compromised 50 other residences, and inflicted as much as $500,000 in total losses, though only minor injuries were reported." - few problems. First, no need to say Florida again. Next, you again use "left [something] {verb-like adjective}". Why not say "destroyed six mobile homes"? More concise. Also, I think it'd read better to say "another 50 residences".
• "Dauphin Island received an 8.4 ft (2.6 m) storm surge that resulted in substantial flooding and total overwash across parts of the island" - I'd switch the end to say "and total overwash in some portions." (or parts)
• "and its similarities to a barrier island, Dauphin Island" - isn't Dauphin a barrier island? The wiki article says so.
• "such as a nearly complete lack of destruction on the its heavily wooded eastern end, and concentrated damage closer to the western side and along areas exposed to the strong easterly winds" - see the mistake? (and not just talking about it being a bit of a run-on, which could also be fixed)
• "The tide gauge at Gulfport" - isn't that in Mississippi?
• "than those in the previous hurricanes Frederic or Camille" - I'd switch to "than those previously in hurricanes Frederic or Camille"
• "at the latter, damages included the cost of healing a Florida Sandhill Crane's injured leg" - I wouldn't consider an injured animal as "damages"
• "the adverse conditions forced the temporary closure of the Lake Pontchartrain Causeway" - should this be preps?
• "with an addition $500,000" - additional?
• "In the days after the hurricane, an increase in heart attack deaths in the Harrison County area was noted." - nothing wrong here, but it's a weak final sentence to the article. I think the first aftermath sentence would be a good cap to the article.

That's it for the article. Looks pretty good in general! --♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 02:22, 1 June 2013 (UTC)

Effects on Cuba?

In the Infobox, Cuba is mentioned as the first of the areas affected, yet in the article there is only a passing reference to Cuba and no mention of any effects of the storm there. NPOV? Lack of data? If there's enough to list it in the Infobox, why not in the article? The closest the article gets to mentioning "effects" on Cuba is in the sentence "Elena triggered rainshowers and thunderstorms over parts of Cuba, The Bahamas, and Hispaniola", yet The Bahamas and Hispaniola are not listed as affected in the Infobox. It all just has a US-centered feel to it. --Haruo (talk) 13:32, 3 September 2015 (UTC)

It says in the first paragraph of the lead, "Elena developed on August 28 near Cuba, and after traveling lengthwise across the island with little impact, it entered the Gulf of Mexico and continued to strengthen" — emphasize mine. I welcome any research you have to offer, but I spent hours searching for Caribbean impact information with almost nothing to show for it. To be sure, though, the effects were minor and routine for tropical wave season. As for the infobox, I always feel compelled to include major landmass hits in the "areas affected", even if no damage occurred. I love a good conspiracy as much as the next guy, but it's just a lack of data in this case. :) – Juliancolton | ^Talk 15:09, 3 September 2015 (UTC)

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Nuclear Power Plant at Crystal River

The Crystal River nuclear power plant lies within the storm's projected path, but Governor Graham said the hurricane posed no danger to the facility, which he said was constructed to withstand winds far stronger than Elena's. State officials said that if tides rose another five feet beyond their level late this afternoon, the Florida Power Corporation would shut down the reactor, although officials said there was no hazard to the plant.

— Preceding unsigned comment added by SaskWolf (talk • contribs) 02:13, 31 August 2019 (UTC)

References