Talk:Ivan Boesky

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This article has been mentioned by a media organization:

Brady Dale (15 September 2015). "Someone Is Manipulating the Wikipedia Page of Insider Trading Crook Dennis Levine". Observer. Archived from the original on 15 September 2015. The online magazine Observer covers allegations that anonymous users (IPs) have for many years been whitewashing Wikipedia articles about Dennis Levine, Michael Milken, Ivan Boesky and others accused of financial malpractice. {{cite news}}: External link in |agency= (help)

Untitled[edit]

Does anyone know where he is now? Vincent 13:30, 21 Oct 2004 (UTC)

I thought I had heard something about hirfrm living in Hawaii without very much money after an ugly divorce. However, I was unable to find a source to substantiate this.

From a recent article:

Ivan Boesky, the once-jailed financier who was a model for Gordon Gekko in "Wall Street," gave [Hillary] Clinton $2,000. Michael Douglas, who played Gekko, gave her $4,600. "Clinton cashes in from A-list: Clinton's $28.6M in record-breaking fundraising comes from a list of nation's wealthy and famous;" Glenn Thrush Newsday, Melville, N.Y. Knight-Ridder/Tribune Business News 04-17-2007 The Sanity Inspector 01:28, 21 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I WAS TOLD HE HAD A RESIDENCE IN LA JOLLA CALIFORNIA, OUTSIDE OF SAN DIEGO. HE HAS A DAUGHTER WHO HAD DATED A MEXICAN BUSINESS MAN —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.0.50.189 (talk) 03:53, 12 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I know that a number of years ago, he went to Moscow, hoping to cash in as some sort of adviser, telling them how to set up their fledgling stock exchange, etc. Newspapers reported that the Russians wouldn't touch him and he went home empty-handed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.151.43.98 (talk) 05:49, 19 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Pronunciation[edit]

Article states "Boesky" rhymes with "whiskey." In the Books on Tape edition of The Crime and Punishment of Michael Milken, "Boesky" is pronounced "Boe skee." —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.172.186.32 (talk) 06:55, 29 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

More on background of Boeskyl[edit]

Can somebody who knows this stuff include what he did after law school but before going to Wall Street? As I recall, he was managing a nightclub in Detroit up until the age of 35 - was drinking and got into a couple of fights - that's why his fiance's father didn't approve of him. Also, can we have some info on the wife angle? I mean, she came from money, and that's where he got the money to start up on Wall Street to begin with (if he hadn't married somebody like her, we probably never would have heard of Ivan Boesky, and he might have spent his career as a nightclub manager). Thanks in advance to anybody that knows (I know it's in books - I've read it before). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.129.156.83 (talk) 20:18, 13 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

If he is still alive and has not been convicted, there is BLP to worry about. He probably has enough money to start a libel action in America. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Greenmamba123123 (talk • contribs) 12:37, 27 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

See www.businessinsider.com. This mentions his wife Seema Silberstein and much said above. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.68.119.201 (talk) 15:33, 24 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Questioning date on "Greed" speech[edit]

The article says a 1986 commencement speech, but I see alternate date in some newspaper and contemporary sources of 1985 -- Orlando Sentinal and abc news and Houma Times for example. It's also clear from Time cover that he's in disfavor by late 1986, but not when he got into it and wouldn't have been asked to speak. Many hits say the speech is 1986, but they're all recent and from share common phrasing "famously defending" so seem to be just copying a deriviative item. It only got prominence after the 1987 Wall Street film, so I'm not expecting anything directly from 1986 and think none of them would have any either, but is there anything from say 1990s covering the date of the speech or quoting the whole speech that's could clear this up ? Markbassett (talk) 15:25, 19 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]

It was on May 18, 1986 at what is now the Haas School of Business of the University of California at Berkeley. That was before the scandal broke in November. For an early piece here is an article from June 1987 in the Washington Post [1] giving the place as Berkeley and the date as roughly a year previous.---- Work permit (talk) 03:03, 31 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Slapping criminals around in article leads[edit]

I do not believe ths reversal is necessary or constructive. Seems to me that we should excercize more caution in using harsh label-wording at the top of any article about a living person. Why do we need that? If nobody disagrees here, I will reverse this again soon. --SergeWoodzing (talk) 08:52, 29 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Are you a friend of Ivan's? YOU may not believe it is "necessary or constructive", but that doesn't mean it isn't. Do you know much about Wall Street??? Boesky would not be notable except for his criminal activity and conviction. I mean, there are literally THOUSANDS of hedge fund managers and arbitrageurs on Wall Street, and they are not notable to have an entry in Wikipedia. Boesky is - and the ONLY reason is his felony conviction. Look, he actually wasn't an arb (an arbitrageur) - a real legit arb makes calculated bets based on legit information on whether a company will get taken over. Boesky wasn't doing that. Are you aware of that? Do you even know what he was doing??? He was getting inside information from criminal investment bankers and front-running the takeovers (go look up what "front-running" is). I would agree with you if, say, his conviction was regarding taking drugs, or drug trafficking, or manslaughter of somebody he got into a fight with - why? - because those would have nothing to do with why he is famous (infamous), how he was making his money, with his profession. Boesky MADE his reputation when he got caught being a criminal on Wall Street. And he wasn't just any criminal - I think it is fair to say that Boesky is known as being one of the biggest criminals on Wall Street during the 1980's, if not THE biggest criminal - he's infamous for it - that is what he is known for - nothing else. If you revert it, I will revert you again. Go look at my entries (starting in June 2006) - most of them are regarding Wall Street - I'm an investment banker by profession. I know this subject matter.

Go look at the profile box - it says, "Known for" and then it says "Insider trading scandal". That is literally what he is known for - his criminal activity - nothing else.

"Comment on content, not on the contributor: Keep the discussions focused on the topic of the talk page, rather than on the editors participating." is how I am used to working as per WP:TPYES. Shouting is another thing I am not accustomed to having to comment on.

The question here is whether or not "convicted criminal ... admitted informant ... infamous" etc belong in the lead of the article. The article text explains all that, & the actions & convictions of this living person do not warrant those words in the lead (just as the attempt to publish his address {4 april this year} was inappropriate). Personal opinions of the man on the part of any Wikipedian are per se irrelevant. --SergeWoodzing (talk) 19:28, 30 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Response to third opinion request:

Hi. I've never edited this article before. Unfortunately, I am very familiar with the whole Boesky affair, but won't let that color my neutrality

I'll put aside WP:BLP considerations and focus my observations on how to best summarize the subject in the LEDE. Done correctly, we should be able to both avoid BLP considerations and make for a stronger LEDE.

There are an estimated 70 million Americans that have a criminal record [2] . By last count, there were 14,000 criminal convictions just last month [3]. Not every one of those criminals are notable. So leading with Boesky being a criminal does not establish his notability, nor does it distinguish him from any other common criminal.

So what makes Ivan Boesky notable? Boesky is famous for being (at the time) a relatively successful wall street arbitrageur who was caught and plead guilty to insider trading. The article should lead with specifically what his occupation was, and what he plead guilty to.

To that end, I am supportive of the first version Ivan Frederick Boesky (born March 6, 1937) is a former American stock trader who became infamous for his prominent role in an insider trading scandal that occurred in the United States during the mid-1980s. However, I feel it could be strengthened. He didn't just have a role in a scandal. He was charged and plead guilty to insider trading. The fine, $100m, was a record for the time. The cooperation he gave in his plea agreement led to the charges against Michael Milken. In what also was an unprecedented procedure, Boesky was allowed to sell his stocks BEFORE news of the conviction (so that he would have the money to pay the fine). This was probably the ultimate, legal, insider trade of all time. -- Work permit (talk) 20:28, 30 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

---- Work permit (talk) 20:28, 30 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Some more specifics. It is better to describe him as a merger arbitrageur.[4]. He bet on merger and take over deals, and got inside information on those deals before they were announced.---- Work permit (talk) 22:31, 30 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]