Talk:Patricia Beer

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Untitled[edit]

Her date of birth is variously given as 1919, 1924 and 1926. Charles Matthews 11:28, 27 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Despite the various birthdates, 1919 seems to be more frequent, and an obituary quoting her husband also indicates 1919 as the birthyear.

See http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4196/is_19990824/ai_n10538642 Quatrocentu 20:47, 12 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Sources to include:[edit]

Sources to include: [1], [2], [3], A History of Twentieth-Century British Women's Poetry by Jane Dowson, Alice Entwistle, [4], [5], [6], [7], [8], [9], [10], [11], [12], [13], [14], [15], [16]. Therapyisgood (talk) 01:59, 2 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

GA Review[edit]

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This review is transcluded from Talk:Patricia Beer/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: The Blue Rider (talk · contribs) 12:14, 5 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]


Good Article review progress box
Criteria: 1a. prose () 1b. MoS () 2a. ref layout () 2b. cites WP:RS () 2c. no WP:OR () 2d. no WP:CV ()
3a. broadness () 3b. focus () 4. neutral () 5. stable () 6a. free or tagged images () 6b. pics relevant ()
Note: this represents where the article stands relative to the Good Article criteria. Criteria marked are unassessed

Comments[edit]

@Therapyisgood: The review is done and the article is on hold. The main problem with this nomination is its broadness; after reading the article I'm still failing to see how is she notable. Surely the almost Poet Laureate of the UK's has a lot of sources out there that can help to establish her notability. I highly recommend more information to be added regarding the content of her works and their influence. Regards. The Blue Rider 22:47, 8 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, I wrote this in about two days or so. If it's OK with you I'd like to leave it open for a while so I can get everything square. Therapyisgood (talk) 03:37, 9 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
No problem, take your time. The Blue Rider 08:54, 9 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Lead[edit]

  • Add wikilink to critic in English poet and critic.
  • For the sake of a more accessible and simpler English, I propose the following:
  • therefrom → from there
  • instilled → implanted
  • I prefer instilled, implanted sounds like an npov violation. Therapyisgood (talk) 19:04, 7 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • B.Litt → Bachelor of Letters

Early life[edit]

  • Add wikilink to sect in a strict religious sect.
  • Hymns were the first poetry Beer wrote. What were those hymns about?
  • extolling → praise
  • Add wikilink to memoir in a memoir published in 1968.
  • Various sources describe her mother as dominant or the dominant parent. How did that impact her? Doesn't Mrs Beer's House, perhaps, offer any insight into that?
  • Patricia went to Exmouth Grammar School after earning a scholarship, where she continued after her mother's death. Why did her mother die? Why would she not continue after her mother's death?
  • B.Litt → Bachelor of Letters
  • On this time in her life, Beer stated she was "enjoying [herself] in a way [she] wasn't allowed to when [she] was a child". Why is that relevant?
  • It shows she was moving away from the strict religious upbringing. Therapyisgood (talk) 19:17, 7 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • Add the year(s) to the following sentences:
  • Patricia went to Exmouth Grammar School
  • her mother's death
  • She studied English at Exeter University
  • becoming a teacher and academic
  • She took her B.Litt at the University of Oxford
  • she spent seven years in Italy
  • Add wikilink to senior lecturer in she became Senior Lecturer.
  • Add wikilink to Victorian in on Victorian women writers

Style, analysis and themes[edit]

  • Contemporary critics influenced Beer, with her stating she could not do her best poetry while thinking about them. Why wasn't she fond of contemporary critics?
  • Add wikilink to simile in incorporating personae and simile.
  • The following phrase uses incorporating two times in a row, I suggest the following rewrite: she moved from incorporating personae and simile to incorporating metaphor → her writing shifted from the use of personae and similes to incorporating metaphor.
  • Beer integrated literary figures native to England into her 1993 work Friend of Heraclitus. Examples of the literally figures native to England?
  • James Persoon and Robert R. Watson of the Encyclopedia of British Poetry, 1900 to the Present cite Gerard Manley Hopkins as an influence... The attribution here seems somewhat futile since both the authors and the encyclopedia are not notable, also it's quite wordy. I suggest the following rewrite: Gerard Manley Hopkins is cited as an influence...
  • The sentence, "legends and landscapes of the West Country also form the background for many of her poems" doesn't fall into WP:QUOTEUSE, so I suggest it to be rephrased as prose.
  • While that's true, it is still generally good to follow it. This quotation could be easily rewritten as prose, otherwise it can raise concerns about its fair use. The Blue Rider 12:03, 8 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • Add wikilink to bucolic in cite the bucolic and rural nature.
  • Per the same reasoning, Similarly, Persoon and Watson cite the bucolic...as an influence → Similarly, the bucolic...is thought to have influenced.
  • Add wikilink to The Gardian in John Mullan of The Guardian.
  • Death is a theme throughout her poetry, especially in Autumn (1997). How is the theme employed in the book?
  • though John Mullan of The Guardian described → though The Guardian described
  • The though in ...though John Mullan of The Guardian described... is WP:EDITORIALIZING; it should be removed.
  • described her last book of poetry. Which book is her last?
  • ...as "more droll than sad". Mullan called her style overall wry melancholy. Why does he call it that?
  • ...as "more droll than sad". Mullan called her style overall wry melancholy → as "more droll than sad" and that her style is overall wry melancholy
  • Add wikilink to The Independent in Neil Powell of The Independent
  • Neil Powell of The Independent cited → The Independent cited
  • Her Reader, in which → In her book, Reader, in which
  • Her Reader, in which she found Jane Austen's women characters to be wanting due to their chasing marriage, represented feminism's early impact on academic criticism. The independent clause that is between commas is too big and makes the phrase confusing to read.
  • Since Harry Blamires is not notable, I suggest the following rewrite: Harry Blamires compared her work to... → Her work was compared to....
  • He cites her prosaic poems as her real problem. Does Schimdt offer any insight on why he thinks that?
  • Overly lengthy attribution, specially since neither the journal nor the author are notable: In the journal AAA: Arbeiten aus Anglistik und Amerikanistik, Göran Nieragden states Beer's "I" stages ego.... I suggest the removal of the journal attribution.

Selected works[edit]

  • Remove the italic from All works cited to the following sources.
  • Put the description of the works in parenthesis. Like this: poems → (poems)

Source check[edit]

  • Checked sources #1, #2, #5, #7, #8, #12 of this version. No issues found.

Copyvio check[edit]

  • Earwig's Copyvio Detector points to 20,6%, mainly due to university, schools and works names/titles.

Stability[edit]

  • The article is not changing significantly from day to day because of an ongoing edit war or content dispute.

Image check[edit]

  • The image is non-free and as so, per WP:NFURG, it should have a copyright tag and a non-free use rationale. The latter is in place but the former is missing. The image is relevant to the topic and has a suitable caption.

Not done yet[edit]

  • Contemporary critics influenced Beer, with her stating she could not do her best poetry while thinking about them. Why wasn't she fond of contemporary critics?
  • The specific source to which it's cited doesn't say. But I'll keep looking out for it, if I recall correctly that specific tidbit is in several sources. Therapyisgood (talk) 03:56, 11 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • Hymns were the first poetry Beer wrote. What were those hymns about?
  • The source doesn't say but I have a feeling it's in Mrs Beer's House, which I will get soon. Therapyisgood (talk) 03:57, 11 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • Various sources describe her mother as dominant or the dominant parent. How did that impact her? Doesn't Mrs Beer's House, perhaps, offer any insight into that?
  • Patricia went to Exmouth Grammar School after earning a scholarship, where she continued after her mother's death. Why did her mother die? Why would she not continue after her mother's death?
  • Beer integrated literary figures native to England into her 1993 work Friend of Heraclitus. Examples of the literally figures native to England?
  • The source doesn't say ("[l]iterary figures, both fictional and nonfictional, are often incorporated into her poetry, and her 1993 volume Friend of Heraclitus includes both a series of sonnets based on her native region of England and examples of modern imagism"). I've cut the "into her 1993 work Friend of Heraclitus" and added "into works frequently" as that doesn't appear to be supported by the source. I will continue to look for examples of her incorporation of literary figures native to England. Therapyisgood (talk) 03:44, 11 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • ...as "more droll than sad". Mullan called her style overall wry melancholy. Why does he call it that?
  • Death is a theme throughout her poetry, especially in Autumn (1997). How is the theme employed in the book?
  • Add the year(s) to the following sentences:
  • Patricia went to Exmouth Grammar School
  • her mother's death
  • She studied English at Exeter University
  • becoming a teacher and academic
  • This is more a summary of the next few sentences and as thus IMO doesn't require a year. Therapyisgood (talk) 06:19, 11 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • She took her B.Litt at the University of Oxford
  • she spent seven years in Italy
  • Since Harry Blamires is not notable, I suggest the following rewrite: Harry Blamires compared her work to... → Her work was compared to....
  • He cites her prosaic poems as her real problem. Does Schimdt offer any insight on why he thinks that?
  • Overly lengthy attribution, specially since neither the journal nor the author are notable: In the journal AAA: Arbeiten aus Anglistik und Amerikanistik, Göran Nieragden states Beer's "I" stages ego.... I suggest the removal of the journal attribution.
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