Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/William Richard Ormsby-Gore, 2nd Baron Harlech
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This page is an archive of the discussion about the proposed deletion of the article below. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made on the article's talk page rather than here so that this page is preserved as an historic record.
The result of the debate was keep. Deathphoenix 03:15, 26 Feb 2005 (UTC)
William Richard Ormsby-Gore, 2nd Baron Harlech[edit]
- Who? Non-notable, 1 line bio, AND the article title doesnt fit bio standard. Alkivar 03:51, 9 Dec 2004 (UTC)
Improperly placed VfD. I'm finishing the process of listing it. —Mar·ka·ci:2005-02-13 10:51 Z
- Keep. All peers are notable and this one is more notable than most: MP for more than 20 years and had many high offices in County Leitrim. Dbiv 10:53, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC)
- Keep but expand, it reads like genealogy. Wyss 11:04, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC)
- Keep - but we do need to know a bit more than just a title; British titles and their history are interesting and important. Brookie 11:46, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC)
- Keep, expand. Megan1967 01:07, 14 Feb 2005 (UTC)
- Keep Categorised to MPs, and that status mentioned. Wincoote 01:26, 14 Feb 2005 (UTC)
- Keep. Peer and MP. Well done Wincoote. Capitalistroadster 10:52, 14 Feb 2005 (UTC)
- Comment: if he was a peer, wasn't he an MP by virtue of being a peer? Many peers never bothered to appear in the House. What, if anything, did he do there? If he did something in or for County Leitrim, let's hear what it was. Pace Brookie, but British titles and their history of are of no interest to me (because I'm British?) and mostly seem to be of little, if any, importance. I'll vote when I know more about him. -- Hoary 04:43, 2005 Feb 15 (UTC)
- He was an MP who inherited a peerage. I haven't had the time to fill out the biog yet. Dbiv 19:45, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)
Delete unless more can be said, if we are to be at all consistent to previous decisions on this page.I strongly disagree that all peers are notable; this chap was the SECOND Baron Harlech, i.e. a peer only because his father was, and Baron is the lowest of the orders of peerage; and will have been in parliament (though MP is always used to refer only to members of the House of Commons) only because he was a peer. If the 'average professor' and the 'average middle school' aren't notable, the average peer certainly isn't. If this chap is notable (and if, indeed, he was an MP), fine, but his reason for note needs to be mentioned and is orthogonal to his peerage.- Comment. He was an MP (House of Commons) for Sligo from 1841 to 1852, and for Leitrim from 1856 until 1876, when he succeeded his brother as 2nd Baron Harlech. His brother, who had been an MP too and a groom-in-waiting of Queen Victoria was created 1st Baron Harlech in 1876, with the special provision that his younger brother (our hero) would inherit the title in the event of no male offspring. The 2nd Baron didn't have to wait long because his brother died the same year. The 2nd Baron was also High Sheriff of County Leitrim, and Lord Lieutenant of County Merioneth. He achieved the rank of major in the 13th Light Dragoons. I don't have any information about whether he did anything notable in these posts. Some of the later Barons Harlech were quite notable. --BM 20:45, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)
- Ah, thank you! I couldn't find anything on the page or in the first few Google hits explaining this. As a Major, an elected MP, a High Sherrif and a Lord Lieutenant, I believe he's notable for reasons mostly unconnected with his peerage; keep assuming that all this information will find its way into the article. I re-emphasise that I don't believe that "all peers are notable" - all a hereditary peerage is is a distinguished family, and in some cases not even that distinguished. (Should I at this point mention the non-notability of my late great-uncle Lord Hatch of Lusby just to taunt someone into making the page?) TSP 22:09, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)
- Lord Hatch of Lusby is very notable! He was one of the last peers to be told formally to shut up by the House when he continued to ask questions and refused to sit down. I think I also ran into someone who lived in the London flat he used to live in, which was in Peckham Rye. Dbiv 22:39, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)
- Sounds like him :-) Write about him then, you seem to know more about him than I do... (It was mostly an idle reference to the traditional "I'm a more notable [a] than he is a [b] and I'm not in Wikipedia", which I see has got one Wikipedian an entry that is currently resisting deletion - I think that pretty much all life peers probably are notable, given that it's about the highest honour the United Kingdom can award.) TSP 00:18, 16 Feb 2005 (UTC)
- Lord Hatch of Lusby is very notable! He was one of the last peers to be told formally to shut up by the House when he continued to ask questions and refused to sit down. I think I also ran into someone who lived in the London flat he used to live in, which was in Peckham Rye. Dbiv 22:39, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)
- Ah, thank you! I couldn't find anything on the page or in the first few Google hits explaining this. As a Major, an elected MP, a High Sherrif and a Lord Lieutenant, I believe he's notable for reasons mostly unconnected with his peerage; keep assuming that all this information will find its way into the article. I re-emphasise that I don't believe that "all peers are notable" - all a hereditary peerage is is a distinguished family, and in some cases not even that distinguished. (Should I at this point mention the non-notability of my late great-uncle Lord Hatch of Lusby just to taunt someone into making the page?) TSP 22:09, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)
- Keep. James F. (talk) 02:22, 16 Feb 2005 (UTC)
- Keep. Mtiedemann 10:50, 16 Feb 2005 (UTC)
This page is now preserved as an archive of the debate and, like some other VfD subpages, is no longer 'live'. Subsequent comments on the issue, the deletion, or the decision-making process should be placed on the relevant 'live' pages. Please do not edit this page.