Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Bullshido/Archive1

Bullshido was proposed for deletion. This page is an archive of the discussion about the proposed deletion. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made on the article's talk page rather than here so that this page is preserved as an historic record. The result of the debate was REDIRECT WITHOUT MERGING to McDojo. 5 votes to delete, 1 of which accepted redirect without merge; 1 vote to redirect without merge, 2 votes to keep, one of which accepted merge/redirect; 1 vote to merge/redirect. This amounts to 6 votes to 3 against merging any content. Counting the 1 clear keep vote as impliedly preferring redirection as an alternative to deletion, the vote is then tied 4 to 4 on the issue of redirect. Accordingly, I will leave it as a redirect. Postdlf 14:04, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Bullshido

Is basically an advert for bullshido.com, a martial arts training site. Does not appear that anyone uses the term outside of them. In any case the article is nearly all first person. Not likely to ever be an encyclopedic article, and is essentially vanity. - Taxman 22:37, Oct 21, 2004 (UTC)

• Weak delete. The term is used pretty frequently on rec.martial-arts, and may predate the site. However, it's not commonly used outside of that newsgroup. The term "bullshitsu" is also sometimes used for the same concept. — Gwalla | Talk 22:54, 21 Oct 2004 (UTC)
• This isn't a good article. I know a thing or two about traditional martial arts as well as the, erm, touchy people who comprise the Western "martial arts community." So, I believe that Bullshido is a notable enough group in that community (such as it is) to deserve an article here, but this article? Feh... Abstain. Fire Star 03:53, 22 Oct 2004 (UTC)
• Delete. This article is bull-shido. Not notable. --Improv 15:22, 22 Oct 2004 (UTC)
• I am actually partly responsible for this article, as it was created by Phrost, the head of the Bullshido websites, at my prompting. It started as a dictdef, and I was hoping to flesh it out into something useful, but someone took a single Ashida Kim related post from Bullshido and slapped it on, and the article has since become rather messy. I might be better off creating a Fraud in martial arts, since that is what I had actually planned on writing about. In any case, I'm going to leave the decision up to more experienced Wikipedians and Abstain. Aesopian

Ah, that explains the scattered appearance of the article. Bullshido (or McDojo) was intended a few years back to expose fraud in the martial arts, a worthy enough motive. Among martial artists with connectivity it is a fairly well known group compared to most others, hence my comments above. Fire Star 15:36, 22 Oct 2004 (UTC)

• Keep, as the term seems notable, needs some work though —siroχo 23:03, Oct 22, 2004 (UTC)
• Redirect to McDojo. The article at present is just a rant copied from somewhere else; I don't think there's anything to add to McDojo. Wile E. Heresiarch 02:03, 23 Oct 2004 (UTC)
• Keep or merge and redirect to McDojo. This is a somewhat notable concept, not somethink that is specific to just bullshido.com. Removing the confusing quote altogether would probably improve the article. jni 09:54, 25 Oct 2004 (UTC)
• Delete or redirect to McDojo. Valid concept; but a bit offensively titled, and who needs two articles? --GenkiNeko 20:48, 25 Oct 2004 (UTC)

I would like to point out that "bullshido" and "McDojo" are rather different terms. A McDojo is a derogatory term for a bad school, while bullshido is a broader concept of fraud in martial arts, and can apply to books, movies, instructors, students, techniques, training methods, belt systems, and just about anything in martial arts. "McDojo" is just a way of saying a school is in some way bullshido. To redirect the broader term to something that would be considered a specific type of bullshido seems backwards to me. As for the term "bullshido" being offense, Wikipedia has articles on fuck and shit, so I don't think this is really an issue. --Aesopian 13:30, 26 Oct 2004 (UTC)

• Delete. Indrian 17:16, Oct 26, 2004 (UTC)

This page is now preserved as an archive of the debate and, like other '/delete' pages is no longer 'live'. Subsequent comments on the issue, the deletion or on the decision-making process should be placed on the relevant 'live' pages. Please do not edit this page.